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View Full Version : Stamina and durability


Shadow
07-03-2009, 07:03 PM
I should state up front that these are not definite for the final game. If they aren't fun, I'll either modify them till they are or take them out. Even if I decide to keep them and you don't like them, they are very easy to mod out (just change a 1 to a 0 in a text file in both cases).

Ok, having said that both of these systems are in now and I think will be cool. I'm trying to make both of these to not be a nuisance, but cause exciting things to happen occasionally. So let me explain how they currently work.

If you run out of stamina, you will only run at half speed so it can be dangerous to run out of stamina at the wrong time (like when you are running from the horde of Orcs). That part is pretty typical. However, you only lose stamina when you are running AND in combat or when something else leeches stamina from you (like a ghost). This might make something like a ghost not too dangerous directly, but if they drain away all of your stamina, you might not be able to run away from other more dangerous monsters (effectively that is). However, if you are just running across the empty level for some reason, stamina will never be a concern.

Durability works similar to other games. If an item gets to 0 durability, it will no longer work until you get it repaired. However, our difference is that normal combat is probably going to have very little wear and tear on items (if any). Critical hits, crushing blows, and bashing through doors might cause some damage, but the real danger will come from specific monsters. Like a special attack from the huge Chaos Lords might do damage to an item and something like an acid attack from a Naga might damage several items at once.

The nice part about these systems is that they can lead to interesting situations that aren't specifically setup in advance. For example, if you are in a town that has lots of Nagas in the dungeon and the town is attacked, you might want to protect your armorsmith.

Both of these systems still need lots of tweaks, but they work. I still have to create items, skills, monsters, traps, and other stuff that impact both of these systems.

So what do you all think?

icekrystal10
07-04-2009, 01:49 AM
i think durability is a good idea. it makes it more realistic. more powerful blows from enemies should cause more damage (like from a champion or boss monster). normal attacks should cause damage, but definitely not as much.

i am neutral on stamina.

Vas
07-06-2009, 10:33 AM
the stamina thing would definetly affect players using hit and run tactiques with ranged characters while a warrior type probably would care less. So for ranged players it should be still balanced out to be fun. As for the durability thing i think it's good, if i knew those hits from a certain monster will damage my armor badly i would probably try to kill it fast.

torikamal
07-07-2009, 06:08 PM
Stamina could be used in place of cooldowns. Use a super spell and you'll feel taxed for a little bit. Do it right away and you might fall over for a few seconds. Same thing for warriors or something like that. I realize it's just a stat change, but it makes more sense in my head than a cool down.

Durability done well is definitely a good idea. As long as you can full repair items back to where they started, it should be OK. It also sounds like they won't be constantly in need of repair, either, so I'm all for that. It also could be a skill that could choose--they take very little durability damage and they can repair items themselves.

(name here)
07-07-2009, 11:54 PM
I like the idea of stamina. It seems like it'll prove interesting and useful, forcing players to be more careful but slotting in easily with identifying items and healing

Durability fills me with rage, however. I'll reserve judgement, but i'm frankly unsure it can be done well while still mattering. I'd advise making the armorsmith easier to protect than he is in Depths of Peril during town attacks, but you should probably do that anyway.

Shadow
07-08-2009, 10:03 AM
Durability fills me with rage, however. I'll reserve judgement, but i'm frankly unsure it can be done well while still mattering. I'd advise making the armorsmith easier to protect than he is in Depths of Peril during town attacks, but you should probably do that anyway.

Technically both armorsmiths and weaponsmiths will be able to repair items and there won't necessarily just be one of each.

ShaggyMoose
07-08-2009, 10:11 PM
Durability works similar to other games. If an item gets to 0 durability, it will no longer work until you get it repaired. However, our difference is that normal combat is probably going to have very little wear and tear on items (if any). Critical hits, crushing blows, and bashing through doors might cause some damage, but the real danger will come from specific monsters. Like a special attack from the huge Chaos Lords might do damage to an item and something like an acid attack from a Naga might damage several items at once.
If you are going to go in this direction, I have a few suggestions:

Don't allow items to perma-break. Its frustrating as hell.
Provide a spell that prevents wear and tear for a limited time. This will allow you to negate the effects desribed above if you are prepared.
Add "indestructable" as a bonus equipment property. This type of weapon/armour would have infinite durability.

SharpCarlos
07-08-2009, 10:29 PM
Don't allow items to perma-break. Its frustrating as hell.
Provide a spell that prevents wear and tear for a limited time. This will allow you to negate the effects desribed above if you are prepared.
Add "indestructable" as a bonus equipment property. This type of weapon/armour would have infinite durability.

Those are great suggestions, and are perfect examples of what I'd like to see in the game: more possibilities for interesting skills and item mods. You could even go the opposite direction of the "indestructible" items and have really powerful items that have terrible durability. You'd probably want to keep those in your pack except for boss fights. Unless you also put points into the anti-wear-and-tear spell (or a blacksmithing skill that would let you repair items yourself, as torikamal suggested).

Kruztee
07-09-2009, 03:01 AM
FLASHBACK: Remember ethereal items in D2?;)

The idea was that they had much less than normal durability than a regular item and could never be repaired, but were extremely powerful to compensate. This was due to the fact that they only partially existed in the physical realm.

I actually thought that they were never powerful enough to compensate for the fact that they would break at the most inopportune moments, and that sooner rather than later you were faced with having to come up with a replacement, but it was an interesting concept nontheless.

Shadow
07-09-2009, 09:43 AM
If you are going to go in this direction, I have a few suggestions:

Don't allow items to perma-break. Its frustrating as hell.
Provide a spell that prevents wear and tear for a limited time. This will allow you to negate the effects desribed above if you are prepared.
Add "indestructable" as a bonus equipment property. This type of weapon/armour would have infinite durability.


In general a broken item will be fixable and I'm planning on an indestructible magic modifier (or something along those lines). A skill might be difficult to do. The idea is good. It's a matter of balance. How does the player have a skill that they can't constantly use to prevent all damage even at skill level 1? The spell could have a really, really long wear down timer, but then I would have to save these. Although it could be a passive skill.

Those are great suggestions, and are perfect examples of what I'd like to see in the game: more possibilities for interesting skills and item mods. You could even go the opposite direction of the "indestructible" items and have really powerful items that have terrible durability. You'd probably want to keep those in your pack except for boss fights. Unless you also put points into the anti-wear-and-tear spell (or a blacksmithing skill that would let you repair items yourself, as torikamal suggested).

Like Kruztee mentioned, Diablo did this with ethereal items. We might do something similar, but I haven't decided yet (need something that makes sense).

FloodSpectre
07-09-2009, 07:18 PM
Like Kruztee mentioned, Diablo did this with ethereal items. We might do something similar, but I haven't decided yet (need something that makes sense).

Maybe go with materials rather than weird ethereal-ness or enchantments. Crystal or Obsidian might be good choices, especially considering how dangerous properly sharpened obsidian can be. But no matter how much you take care of obsidian it will still break eventually. Perhaps you could go with that, making an obsidian sword inflict greater damage but give it a lower durability with no chance of repair. It might even be interesting add penalties to the weapon's damage for each point of durability lost to sort of simulate the wear on the blade's edge.

Shadow
07-09-2009, 07:33 PM
We won't don't do ethereal. Crystal or obsidian might work though.

ShaggyMoose
07-10-2009, 08:47 PM
We won't don't do ethereal. Crystal or obsidian might work though.
What about a possessed weapon that repairs itself by feeding on the souls of the slain... MWHAHAHAHAHA!