PDA

View Full Version : Megatopic III: Items/Misc/Crazy stuff jamboree


getter77
02-19-2010, 03:55 PM
For pretty well everything else, with great liberty taken for "Misc" to count for all manner of topics---especially those that cross multiple streams. This one is also pretty fluid in terms of surely more to come to mind amidst the lot of us.

-There might as well be Thrown potions for the rest of the damage spectrum in the game aside from just Fire and Ice. Adds needed variety and will enable more unusual builds to approach viability moreso.

-ITEM MAGIC! Here and there, I've seen Spells/Effects carried on items that have no analogue to any class skills available to the player---nor is there any information given as to the specific mechanics to these things. This contrasts big time with the likes of Diablo 2 where such things were direct manifestation of known/elective class skills. Considering the Spell effects and such are already there graphically and whatnot, I'd like to see a major overhaul/fleshing out expansion to this in terms of the information given via tooltips, nature of these "Proc Spells" for lack of a better terms, and quite possibly outright integration to existing class skill pages in line with there being plenty more room for additional, flavorful Active skills with respect to my proposed class/skill overhaul topic.

-Let's perhaps have a rare Magical Skeleton Key that functions more like a duration potion when activated that can open anything for that time period. Likewise, let's have some MUCH tougher chests/doors in terms of their resistances to various types of magic and damage outright to go in line with their spoils---actually have scenarios where you'd very likely want to risk diving deeper for a key/enough appropriate brute force to manage to open it outside of trapping it and such.

-I'd like to see Summon and otherwise traps generate in part of much larger diameters/sizes so as to indicate a more dramatic effect when appropriate. For example, a Giant Summon trap could Summon a much larger number of foes OR perhaps one strong Giant one or even just OOD/uncommon types---yet more things to keep the player on their toes and able to generally rely on "guessing" but not "knowing". Bigger rewards for disarming too, of course. Granted, it should be a choice to disarm the likes of a Summon trap as the boons of the fight itself could well outweigh discretion.

-If terrible/low level equipment still dropping as the levels get higher and higher is unavoidable, let's have something to at least offer some benefit to it. Perhaps one solution is to make this a quirk of the Gambler for questing---he'll actually pay good money(no reputation) for a large chunk of junk brought in a heap, but then he (might) just factor it into his wares available for Gambling to you---thus gaining the gold but making Gambling a riskier business with said Gambler in a town considering he can potentially have very good stuff. Alternatively, other vendors could be seeking out large quantities of these assorted "base" types so as to unlock a better overall selection with more raw materials to work with, or to perhaps result in an overall discount of said thing(s) from their establishment due to the then newly acquired resources.

-Meals. A combination of Food and Drink so as to only take up one inventory slot and function at, perhaps a roughly composite, rate as if you took one of each. Perhaps with a bit longer cumulative cool down period. This would also allow for New questing situations in terms of "ingredient" (base foodstuffs like milk, quail, etc) gathering to unlock them as well as strike another notch into the consumable prices/availability/machine influence bracket. Not to mention one doesn't have to mix these meal in equal proportion and it would be entirely interesting for certain meals to impart benefits other than health and mana regeneration, secret recipes can be found for dungeon quests not unlike weapon, secret plans, and buried treasure notes---offering yet another reason as well to continue to descend should one happen to "save" a town early relative to how many deeper unexplored floors remain. Much fun can be had with this and of that I'm certain.

-Do Spiders actually use Webs tactically? Every single one I encountered just wanted to jump/charge me. Let's have some active web-spinners if not already there and actually active. Makes for a good variety of Web/Poison/Paralysis styled spiders to contend with----perhaps delineated via color markings.

-Let's have Haste potions or some such to offer a bit of a boost when dealing with cleared areas or a little bit more in your favor for frantic rescue/assault/etc quests. Sugarwater for a quick boost but lethargic penalties after it wears off? And so on.

-If there happens to be any other art resources or whatnot able, legally and otherwise, to be reused/implemented in Din's Curse from prior Soldak fare---let's just roll with it as that would provide additional fodder/building blocks for quest ideas, dungeon issues, and so on where appropriate. I've never understood the "recycling is bad" notion considering this is all set in the same rough universe to my understanding---plus this framework should allow for interesting updates to things in effect if not appearance outright.

-Unless I've just not encountered it, have it possible for Dungeon generated questing NPC's to secretly be powerful Changelings that attack you upon successfully completing their quest.

-Let's have a town where everybody is a Spirit a la the ones you can sometimes find with Vengeance quests in the dungeon. I'm picturing a micro dungeon, filled with strong/interesting Uniques and an Altar/maybe Totems, and all the spirits want vengeance for their quest demands to be at peace and save the town. Said town would be immune to town attacks, but also then not possible to engage in commerce save an amazingly lucky traveling vendor appearance perhaps---just a slaughter to result in a peaceful ghost town, with maybe 1-2 townsfolk, constituting the "save" before traveling elsewhere. Quick/brutal/challenging potential...and a bit of thematic appeal in terms of an especially heroic, yet somber, role for Din's would-be champion. As would it be a good contrast to the "destroyed" towns already in-game.

-I'd be a big fan of seeing new skills/items relative to the like of "Ground Liquid" situations as I envision to more dramatic effect in regards to my thoughts on barrels and such. Things like some characters having a viable hit and run skill/item, for a change as hit and run is nigh impossible to my attempts, while rapidly losing stamina in the form of setting down an Acid trail in their wake, slinging some oil out to strategically create a fire hazard, and other such things. Pretty much another case of the effect already being there visually and functionally so just having it more possible to manipulate in the game world.

-Let's have Perception(the tooltip for it) be rather verbose in explaining exactly what bearing it has in terms of the various things it seems to have an effect on.

-Let's have a Petrified/Shrunken/etc village that you perhaps quest to restore or avenge...as they would also make for worthy scenarios alongside Cursed, Plagued, and so on already there.

-Somewhere, somehow, make the hierarchy of str/dex requirements along equipment lines available knowledge to the player very early on so that they can better/more strategically reckon their stat distribution as well as use of Cursed or "of Ease" pieces within their build of choice/shopping/gambling endeavors.

-Have Summons scale to the player level, or at least always one level behind that and/or at least level 1---as it is surely plausible that a Summoner could control something only of a slightly lesser level than they themselves are. That and other general skill growth improvements as I mention in the other topic should largely do the trick alongside the ongoing AI work.

-Perhaps have Earthquakes happen on the surface with a slight chance of an NPC falling down a resulting shaft where they stood and thus needing a rescue?

-Stunlock is a severe seeming issue to deal with, perhaps make it a far less common capability among enemies/restricted to some species/simply a good bit harder to manage?

-Knockback seems like a good staple to implement(moreso?) in general and/or interwoven into some existing skills/weapon types.

-If there are not already "Champions of the God(dess) X" aside from Din possible to generate in the game then surely that would be a very good idea to implement? Fallen ones too, just for kicks and as perhaps an indicator as to how bad the "real" ones could well be.

-Let's have a world possible where dungeons can be absolutely loaded with support beams, it'll be grand...

-Let's also have a situation pop up where perhaps an entire Micro-dungeon or floor is entirely composed of Secret Walls transitioning to lesser vaults, money vaults, on up the scale of danger and intrigue---throw off the standard "wandering" crawl for a bit of "discovery" crawl.

-More flavor to Weapon racks/Armor stands...ie Cursed ones only dropped Cursed stuff and so on.

-Add (additional?) Vendor types like Thrown weapons, Proc Gear, Capes, Jewelers, Repairman that only sells Keys, Map/Recipe seller, and so on.

-Why does an Apothecary not deal in medicinal tasks? Maybe give him some lesser Blessing type abilities to deal with Poison and the like or something.

-I've seen one while raining, but I can't recall a Town at Night. Would make for far better ambiance during a raid, betrayal, or other such matters.

That's about the shake of it I've managed to wring out of my head thus far.

Cadfan
02-19-2010, 04:11 PM
1. The spider's "web then leap" or "leap then web" tactic is actually really good against certain characters. If you're a ranged character, this stops you from running away, and gets or keeps the spider in melee. If you're a melee character, its less dangerous, but I think that's ok.

2. I agree on the champions of other gods. Other gods have shrines, why not give them champion npcs or monsters?

Ephemera
02-19-2010, 04:29 PM
Spiders in a room full of ranged attackers and liches can be brutal for a melee character. Just brutal.

Aganazer
02-19-2010, 05:14 PM
I like this idea of a ghost town that is unaffected by town attacks. Also, shrunken and giant towns sound like fun. While we're at it, how about a lizardman town, orc town, etc? It would be especially cool if they had some themed quests for their race. The towns themselves get a bit samey right now.

FloodSpectre
02-19-2010, 06:51 PM
I've been thinking about magical item attributes a lot lately, and there are several things I'd like to see added in. Some of these are pretty specific to Din's, while others I've borrowed from other ARPGs. Some of these may already be in the game but I doubt I've seen all of them yet, so bear with me here.

1: Trap-related gear. Bonuses to disarm traps, which should work with characters lacking said skill already but also stacking with the Disarm Traps skill. An effect allowing you a chance to pass over a trap without triggering it. An effect reducing the damage from earthquakes, cave-ins, and other environmental damage, such as from pools of acid and whatnot.

2: Life Leech. It doesn't even have to be a huge amount, but some level of life leech would be very useful. There could even be a cursed type of life leech, granting you the life stealing ability while slowly draining your health while not in combat but still in the dungeon? Though I'm sure many players would simply un-equip and re-equip frequently in that case.

3: Certain item types should be more or less likely to carry certain types of bonuses. As some examples, shields may be more likely to carry resists, helmets giving resistance to cave-ins and more perception, or boots giving stamina increases. An axe should be less likely to give me intelligence, as should plate mail.

4: Unique or larger bonuses for Elite and better items. Perhaps Froststriker has a 50% chance to freeze an enemy when hitting, or an elite shield has a decent chance to outright redirect any ranged attack when you block. There could even be special "granted skills" given by certain high level artifacts and legendary items, skills that no character has access to without said item.

getter77
02-19-2010, 07:21 PM
1. The spider's "web then leap" or "leap then web" tactic is actually really good against certain characters. If you're a ranged character, this stops you from running away, and gets or keeps the spider in melee. If you're a melee character, its less dangerous, but I think that's ok.

2. I agree on the champions of other gods. Other gods have shrines, why not give them champion npcs or monsters?

My issue with 1. is actually that I've NEVER happened see any manner of Spider actively "web" at all....it was/has always just been a leap fest no different than getting charged same as any other melee foe. So, maybe their propensities can be adjusted to make heavier use of their racial quirk?

-Definitely like the idea of +skiller and +trap like bonuses as well as a logical pre/suf generation range respective to gear types. Perhaps some dealing with "luck" situations as well like Gambling, Evil Pools, and other things I've mentioned across the topics that involve it in a way different than just the likes of gold/item/magic find for drops?

Shadow
02-19-2010, 07:48 PM
Spiders can walk and jump through spider webs so there is some difference already.

FloodSpectre
02-20-2010, 02:38 PM
Plate armor tends to be a fairly frequent drop for a type of armor only one specialization can use, especially considering they need to buy an expensive skill for it. Maybe the game can sort of "cheat" the drops in a way that reduces (but doesn't eliminate) the rate of plate drops for characters unable to ever use it by checking to see whether they have the Plate skill available to them, regardless of whether they've actually put points into it yet.

The strength req is also a little high on plate considering a Defender might want to split points between three attributes. They want Strength for good weaponry and heavy armor, Dexterity for a good defense rating and Vitality for a lot of health to absorb what gets through their armor and block rate. Maybe the Strength requirement on plate could be cut by 1/3 and a Vitality requirement could be added (10+the 1/3 removed from the strength req), so a 60 str breastplate would instead need 40 str and 30 vit. It makes a certain amount of sense when you consider that Vitality determines Stamina, something you'd definitely need to keep moving with that much metal on your body.

getter77
02-24-2010, 02:27 PM
-I think it would be best to have a big overhaul of the Unique(maybe Assassins too?) monsters to add flavor, personality, and memorability. From The Butcher, to Gollum, to Sigmund---distinctive and memorable Unique foes among the hordes are a staple pillar for Roguelike'ish games and just plain work well for story purposes. While I doubt mini-biographies can be done like Angband and the like for them, I would like to see them "stabilized", on top of made interesting, in terms of their powers and such per each of the 3 difficulty modes. As it is now, they are little more than names with a different appearance and some random smattering of buffs devoid of anything memorable enough to add any entrants to the rage-quit/fearful Hall of Fame like those I mention above.

viper34j
02-24-2010, 02:43 PM
I see your point getter, but I must disagree with it in the context of Din's Curse. I love that boss monsters are randomized. I'd rather be able to play through a custom story that is being created right before me than have a pre-generated boss that is predictable and "stable".

Just the other day I was playing a world where the main boss was a level 25 Recon Totem. It was hilarious seeing the quest updates where the Recon Totem would send enemies to the town or create an uprising. I really started to believe that the Recon Totem was sentient and was something to be feared. Once I got to him, he had surrounded himself with a gathering of oranged named (forgot what these are called) mobs that took me quite a while to work through. Once I did, he was just a stationary object that couldn't defend himself. The Recon Totem still had a life though, he had a story, he had his will done by his minions, even though he was just an object that couldn't defend himself anymore than a common barrel.

I just randomly generated over "stable".

Aganazer
02-24-2010, 03:02 PM
couldn't defend himself anymore than a common barrel.

I don't know man, some of those barrels are pretty nasty. I've lost plenty of escorts to a burning barrel, but not a one to recon totems. :D

Ikarius
02-24-2010, 04:22 PM
My feedback on magic items so far-
Weapons with bonus fire damage are a pain, because they light doors/chests/barrels on fire. You then have to wait for them to finish burning before going through them, which seems to take a bit long. I will say it's mitigated by the ability to swap weapons, but it's still a bit of a pain.

getter77
02-24-2010, 06:43 PM
I see your point getter, but I must disagree with it in the context of Din's Curse. I love that boss monsters are randomized. I'd rather be able to play through a custom story that is being created right before me than have a pre-generated boss that is predictable and "stable".

Just the other day I was playing a world where the main boss was a level 25 Recon Totem. It was hilarious seeing the quest updates where the Recon Totem would send enemies to the town or create an uprising. I really started to believe that the Recon Totem was sentient and was something to be feared. Once I got to him, he had surrounded himself with a gathering of oranged named (forgot what these are called) mobs that took me quite a while to work through. Once I did, he was just a stationary object that couldn't defend himself. The Recon Totem still had a life though, he had a story, he had his will done by his minions, even though he was just an object that couldn't defend himself anymore than a common barrel.

I just randomly generated over "stable".

I don't know that we're disagreeing much---I'm in strong favor of random bits...just that it would add to the appeal to also have some hand-crafted, evocative denizens alongside them for a bit of flavor. Afterall, totally random bits are all well and good so long as players actually come across them---otherwise they don't necessarily exist in any functional sense/add anything to the experience.

FloodSpectre
02-24-2010, 07:13 PM
Just the other day I was playing a world where the main boss was a level 25 Recon Totem. It was hilarious seeing the quest updates where the Recon Totem would send enemies to the town or create an uprising. I really started to believe that the Recon Totem was sentient and was something to be feared. Once I got to him, he had surrounded himself with a gathering of oranged named (forgot what these are called) mobs that took me quite a while to work through. Once I did, he was just a stationary object that couldn't defend himself. The Recon Totem still had a life though, he had a story, he had his will done by his minions, even though he was just an object that couldn't defend himself anymore than a common barrel.

A little off-topic, but I once had a quest involving someone's sister being killed by a Recon Totem. They seem pretty ruthless, especially after reading your story about them.

incognoscente
02-24-2010, 09:04 PM
I admire Timother's restraint there. Recon Totem is a --.

Delilah Rehm
02-25-2010, 10:16 AM
Oh viper34j! That recon story is hilarious!!! :D Love it!