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Jorlen
05-12-2010, 12:18 PM
Din's Curse does all the right things for me.

It has excellent replayability, a fun class system that allows for tons of experimentation / flexibilty, a good random item / random level system, etc.

So, apart from other games mentioned here, are there any other games you guys have played that combine diablo / roguelike elements so well?

dnuggs40
05-12-2010, 03:00 PM
Not really...I mean...you got your more popular ARPG 's which I am sure you are well aware of most of them...but they lean more towards the Diablo and not so much to the roguelike. Din's Curse is pretty unique really with how well it blended the two genres.

I can't really think of anything so I'll just throw a game out there with similar concept (sorta lol) that you might have missed...

Arx Fatalis - Kinda like a roguelike in that you delve deeper and deeper into a dungeon (whole game world is underground), but gameplay is from 3rd person. Awesome magic system, absolutely wonderful sounds that makes the game drip atmosphere, very interactive game world, and lots of interesting things to do/see. Arx pays homage to games like Ultima and I think they did well with this.

getter77
05-12-2010, 03:51 PM
http://www.shrapnelgames.com/Chronic_Reality/SW/SW_page.html There is much potential and good times to be had with this one right here, but slim to nobody believes me! ;) It definitely has LOTS of style and panache.

Soonish....soon that I can get things squared away otherwise I will try to resurrect it via the ridiculous/ahead of its time RAGE Engine the game gives you to run utterly wild with....

:breaks down into a madman's laughter:

Jorlen
05-12-2010, 03:53 PM
Not really...I mean...you got your more popular ARPG 's which I am sure you are well aware of most of them...but they lean more towards the Diablo and not so much to the roguelike. Din's Curse is pretty unique really with how well it blended the two genres.

I can't really think of anything so I'll just throw a game out there with similar concept (sorta lol) that you might have missed...

Arx Fatalis - Kinda like a roguelike in that you delve deeper and deeper into a dungeon (whole game world is underground), but gameplay is from 3rd person. Awesome magic system, absolutely wonderful sounds that makes the game drip atmosphere, very interactive game world, and lots of interesting things to do/see. Arx pays homage to games like Ultima and I think they did well with this.

Arx and Ultima Underworld rank as some of my favorite games actually :)

And you're right, I don't think any other game has blended these sub-genres in specific. Din's curse appears to be the first.

dnuggs40
05-12-2010, 03:55 PM
http://www.shrapnelgames.com/Chronic_Reality/SW/SW_page.html There is much potential and good times to be had with this one right here, but slim to nobody believes me! ;) It definitely has LOTS of style and panache.

Soonish....soon that I can get things squared away otherwise I will try to resurrect it via the ridiculous/ahead of its time RAGE Engine the game gives you to run utterly wild with....

:breaks down into a madman's laughter:

I forgot about this game lol...and I did play it before. It is very similar to Dins/Roguelike...personally I couldn't get into it though :o

@Jorlen

We have similar tastes...Arx is one of my favorites as well. I thinks it's a very under appreciated game that was overshadowed by the behemoth that is Morrowind (a great game in it's own right).

I was reading on the Arkane forums and supposedly an Arx 2 is the works...or at least the community rep made it sound that way. Personally I hope so!

Jorlen
05-12-2010, 04:40 PM
I forgot about this game lol...and I did play it before. It is very similar to Dins/Roguelike...personally I couldn't get into it though :o

@Jorlen

We have similar tastes...Arx is one of my favorites as well. I thinks it's a very under appreciated game that was overshadowed by the behemoth that is Morrowind (a great game in it's own right).

I was reading on the Arkane forums and supposedly an Arx 2 is the works...or at least the community rep made it sound that way. Personally I hope so!

Eh, neat I had never heard about this game. I guess the smaller indie games sometimes don't make it in the databases or many review sites I check. Scallywag sounds like a roguelike for sure, I'll download the demo and try it out, thanks Getter77!

Yeah, I'm not holding my breath re: Arx 2, but it would be a nice surprise indeed!

Teddy
05-12-2010, 08:37 PM
So, apart from other games mentioned here, are there any other games you guys have played that combine diablo / roguelike elements so well?

Have you tried Torchlight yet?

It's only $10 on Steam at the moment. I found it at PAX 2009 and eagerly awaited it's release. It's a very fun ARPG.

udm
05-13-2010, 12:32 AM
I second Arx Fatalis too.

TheRani
05-13-2010, 02:30 AM
The only other games I've played that were anything like Din's Curse (Random dungeons and quests with Diablo-like gameplay) were Darkstone, Fate, and Torchlight. They're all prettier than Din's Curse, but none of them are as much fun.

Jorlen
05-13-2010, 10:34 AM
The only other games I've played that were anything like Din's Curse (Random dungeons and quests with Diablo-like gameplay) were Darkstone, Fate, and Torchlight. They're all prettier than Din's Curse, but none of them are as much fun.

I haven't played Darkstone. I wonder if it would run on windows 7. I keep hearing people mention that one over the years, but I never ended up trying it out. So it has random levels too?

Fate I played to death, and Torchlight I can't seem to get into for some reason. I figure it's just not the right time for it. Or maybe I played too much fate and Torchlight is too similar.

Jorlen
05-13-2010, 12:59 PM
In my searches I found someone who gave nethack an isometric view and made it more user friendly.

I haven't tried it yet, but if you're a fan of rogue/nethack it might be worth a look. It's free.

http://falconseye.sourceforge.net/index.html

TheRani
05-13-2010, 10:23 PM
I haven't played Darkstone. I wonder if it would run on windows 7. I keep hearing people mention that one over the years, but I never ended up trying it out. So it has random levels too?

Fate I played to death, and Torchlight I can't seem to get into for some reason. I figure it's just not the right time for it. Or maybe I played too much fate and Torchlight is too similar.

Darkstone's character aging thing was a big turn-off for me, but it did a lot of other stuff in an interesting way. I don't think it's particularly Windows 7 compatible, but I think there are probably workarounds for that. It's very hard to find now, and more expensive than it's worth, really. When you start a new game, it has the same starting town every time, but it randomly chooses a number of areas from a list of possible areas and stuck them together, connected by wilderness. Each area would have its own dungeon and quests, and once you finish the quests in an area, you'd get one of the 7 gems you needed to collect in order to fight the boss and save the world. The list of possible areas it randomly picks your areas from for your game is not nearly long enough, so if you play often enough, you'll experience a good bit of deja vu. And because of the stupid character aging thing (characters age at a ridiculous pace and you have 2 of them, and yes, you can lose stats from aging, and even die of old age), you'll be praying that the fountain of youth quest area pops up as often as possible.

Jorlen
05-14-2010, 10:40 AM
Darkstone's character aging thing was a big turn-off for me, but it did a lot of other stuff in an interesting way. I don't think it's particularly Windows 7 compatible, but I think there are probably workarounds for that. It's very hard to find now, and more expensive than it's worth, really. When you start a new game, it has the same starting town every time, but it randomly chooses a number of areas from a list of possible areas and stuck them together, connected by wilderness. Each area would have its own dungeon and quests, and once you finish the quests in an area, you'd get one of the 7 gems you needed to collect in order to fight the boss and save the world. The list of possible areas it randomly picks your areas from for your game is not nearly long enough, so if you play often enough, you'll experience a good bit of deja vu. And because of the stupid character aging thing (characters age at a ridiculous pace and you have 2 of them, and yes, you can lose stats from aging, and even die of old age), you'll be praying that the fountain of youth quest area pops up as often as possible.

Yeah, I looked into it more and found out it's locked at 640x480 (shame because it's in 3D) and it would look really bad on my monitor, which is actually my TV (no room for a desk in our tiny apartment). I also wasn't aware of this aging thing, it doesn't sound particularly fun.

No, after searching and trying I've come to the realization that for the moment, Din's Curse is the only game of this style I'm able to enjoy. Guess it raised the bar too high.

getter77
05-14-2010, 05:02 PM
Of course, if we open to the realm of free games/a BIT different---there is always one of the greatest ever with one of the briskest development paces I've ever seen:

Triangle Wizard!

http://trianglewizard.webs.com/index.htm

The one and only game thus far I can "function" in that sort of uses "ASCII"..

Only this one will have a 'K" literally gallop across the screen at you in an effort to knock you back several feet into a protruding wall spike...

DeathKnight1728
05-25-2010, 02:39 PM
There was one game that could have been great, Dungeon Lords. I liked the ideas for the classes, and I loved the races (lizard men, Tiger men, Bear men). But when i get to play it, it runs slow. Plus it reminds me of morrowind, which i hate. Other than that, it could have been good.

Viliki
05-30-2010, 03:34 AM
...
Fate I played to death, and Torchlight I can't seem to get into for some reason. I figure it's just not the right time for it. Or maybe I played too much fate and Torchlight is too similar...

In fact the games are very different even if the designer of Fate brought into Torchlight many design idea. In fact many design coming from Fate have been made very different in Torchlight. And strangely for most of those Fate idea they work less well in Torchlight. Here some example :

The pet system is very similar in both games but in fact hugely different. In Fate pet morph can allow you use the pet as a major fighting tool, in Torchlight there's much less morph and those stronger are far to be as efficient than those in Fate.
There's almost everything of the gem system of Fate alas Torchlight tried make it deeper by adding a gem crafting but this point destroy the whole system and make it boring.
For the fishing system I prefer the mini game version in Torchlight but the rewards from fishing don't work very well when in Fate the fishing results are much more rewarding even if overall the system can break some balance, for example you can start the game with a ton of gold by fishing in town and with a bit of patience but not that much.


But Torchlight is also much more than a remake of Fate, there's a huge difference, Torchlight has a great class skill system and the main Fate spells, when Fate has no real skills. But the main point is how interesting are many skills designed in Torchlight. It's much more than buffer, damages or defences increases, long range or short range attacks, elemental attacks or resistances. There's a lot of nice skills adding a lot to the fun of the action. Here some example:

Stampede: It makes you do a fast forward movement on a short distance and you bash everything on your path and knock back enemies. It is great to reach faster an enemy, or make a quick flee to escape a dangerous situation.
Slash attack : You make a slash in front of you and you hit everything in range and inside that half circle in front of you, not need to aim a precise target. It's a great tool to dispose of a large number of enemies in your range. It is easy to use because you don't need aim but it requires more than just hit the attack key because it's only the half circle in front of you. A variation is that many weapons can have a knock back effect and this add a lot to this attack.
Shadow Armor: A shadow warrior envelop you and attack if anything is in range. It's not the classical retaliation attack, going near something is enough to make the shadow attack this something, so you have a simplified control of those attacks but still have one, it's where you move.
Entropic Aura: It's a more classical design as it's an aura but it's effect is to slowdown anything in range of the aura and that's much more fun than many other aura design.
Chain Vortex: It's a slow attack with a giant sword summoned only for the attack. The range is longer than standard weapons but the attack is slow, so it's a great tool and it's quite more than pure damages change.
Titan Stomp: You make a jump and when you fall on ground all enemies in range get hurt but also get knock back somehow, it can be a great tool for managing crowds but also to get some free space in a bad situation, enough so you could escape.
Ember Lance: It's a beam attack that go through obstacles but also through enemies, it can be tactically huge.
Ice Shock: Have a chance to freeze the target and foes around it.
Ember Bolt: No need to aim, throw three bolts in front of you hitting close targets in front of you and with a knock back effect, great to attack and push back a little closer enemies.
Ember Phase: You teleport on a short distance and do damages around you at start position and at arrival position.
Ember shock: Hit a target and target close around it and stun them for a very short time.
Ricochet: Throw a projectile than can bounce through obstacles and pass through targets, there's ton of application, like hitting multiple time a target with bounces, use the ability to pass through targets to hit multiple targets in a line, shot in corners and more.
Explosive shot: It's a sort of mini rocker launcher effect. Combined with a weapon with knock back, it's a funny one.
Seeking shot: Three missiles are thrown, and each seek a target.
Stab: Brutal move forward attack with a knock back effect. A variation of Stampede for another class.
Devouring Trap: A trap doing no damages but make damages to armor of opponents set in the trap.
Many more.


Even if Fate has a bit more spells, Fate is far to offer those skills and the point is how many are very interesting because they are more than buffer/damages/chance to hit and many offer special tactical possibilities.

Another major point is the general design of monsters that give you time to react. For example many missiles are very slow and you can really dodge them and that's very fun. For example in Din's Curse missiles tend be too fast and don't let you much opportunity to dodge them apart by anticipating with movements but that's a lot less fun than dodging is.

I'm always surprised each time I see someone who have played Torchlight and haven't see all the possibilities and diversity in the action that no other similar game have and from far (Diablo 3 will most probably have this depth but Diablo 2 doesn't have this as deep and diversified). That said Torchlight hasn't a design fully polished and if the fights are a lot more fun than in Din's Curse or Fate, both games have qualities making their action very fun, a bit less for Fate and a bit more for Din's Curse. But both games would be significantly improved with most skills of Torchlight.

TaggArt
11-16-2010, 03:44 PM
Anyone remember "Demise:Rise of the Ku'Tah"
Its an Oldie , but it had me hooked for a whie

getter77
11-16-2010, 05:30 PM
Not personally as I was far too late to the party.

However, you will probably want to wander over to the main site where there should be an enhanced remake/expansion thing released sometime soonish.

http://www.decklinsdemise.com/news.php

caldazar
11-16-2010, 06:11 PM
Anyone remember "Demise:Rise of the Ku'Tah"
Its an Oldie , but it had me hooked for a whie

TaggArt - I was an alpha/beta tester for Demise...if you get down to the cemetery on level 27 I think it was...you should see a tombstone for either "llew silverhand" or "silverhand". I still have it, and am looking forward to the Ascension expansion that they are working on over @ DecklinsDemise.

:D

Shadow
11-16-2010, 07:59 PM
I still have the poster that came with Demise on my wall.