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View Full Version : [Bug] Hostilities out of nowhere.


Tuidjy
07-22-2013, 05:40 PM
I have to admit, I am not quite sure what's going on, but I have been encountering some weirdness again and again, and I think there's a bug somewhere on the bottom of it. So, if anyone cares, he'll have to go through the whole wall of text below.

In my current sector, I have Drox, Dryad and Sector allied, and at war against Human. Shadow was also at war against Human, in a non-aggression pact with Drox, and a mutual protection pacts with Cortex and Dryad. Seemingly out of the blue, Shadow attacked Cortex, despite having 74.9 relation with them, bringing the alliance's wrath down on themselves. Of course, with the relations being what they were, it took me about five seconds to broker a peace between Drox, Dryad, Cortex, and Shadow.

So, no real harm done, but the whole thing was really stupid of Shadow, and I do not think that it is due to a bug in diplomacy. Instead, I think there is a bug with planets that get recolonized by a different race. Cortex had just destroyed the Lithosoid colony on Plar, and Shadow colonized it soon afterwards. As soon as that happened, Shadow attacked Cortex.

I have been attacked, earlier, by ships belonging to a race I was allied with, without the race going to war with me. I believe it happened soon after a planet changed hands, either by infestation, or by being destroyed and recolonized by another race. I have also seen ships where the model and insignia did not match - i.e. an Utopian flying brick with a Cortex icon. These may be popped by a planet after it has changed hands, and retain some attributes from the former masters. This is of course just speculation, but I think worth looking into.

Tuidjy
08-04-2013, 03:52 PM
Ok, this has happened two more times to me, and once, it happened right on my screen. There is definitely a bug that causes a war that should not be.

The first time: Lithosoid and Drakk are allied and at war with Overlord. Drakk destroys a planet belonging to Overlord, Lithosoid colonizes it, and declares war on Drakk. I keep brokering peace, they keep starting a war (despite starting from 100 relationship) eventually, the relationship goes down to where I cannot fix things.

The second time: Drakk and Fringe are allied. Legion takes over a Drakk planet. I blow it up. One of the guardians reverts(!) to Drakk, and starts shooting at a passing Fringe colony ship. Fringe declares war on Drakk. I keep brokering peace, but every time I succeed, the damn ship starts it again. It keeps shooting at me, but I cannot fire back, my fighters do not fire back, and my area of effect weapons cannot hurt it. I keep brokering peace, they keep starting a war (despite starting with relationships in the 80s) eventually, the relationships go down to where I cannot fix things.

CaptainWinky
08-05-2013, 11:22 AM
Something similar happened to me two days ago, playing 1.017 beta. The Drox wanted me to make an alliance between Human and Fringe. I did that, destroying the other races in the process, and got a diplomatic victory. I took time to finish the remaining quests. During that time Overlord took over a planet. I figured I'd go wipe them out just for the heck of it. Ignoring their two ships, I destroyed the colony on the planet. The ships changed to Human (IIRC) and took a few potshots at me. I immediately stopped shooting and just ran away assuming it would sort itself out somehow. A few seconds later, Human declared war on Fringe. I went into the trading screen and was able to convince them to make peace. They gradually rebuilt relations while I finished my last remaining quests.

Cardinal Ape
08-05-2013, 07:42 PM
Instead, I think there is a bug with planets that get recolonized by a different race.

Yeah, I have noticed some weird stuff going on lately. I saw a Brunt planet get killed then colonized by the Fringe. The planet produced Brunt ships with Fringe flags.


Also it seems that race ships stay locked onto their targets even after peace is made. More than once I have made peace with a race and their ships that were on my screen at the time of the deal will stay locked on to me and keep firing. Since they are now peaceful I can not shoot back at them, the only thing I can do is jump into a gate of some kind, then they will stop shooting at me.

Laivasse
08-07-2013, 01:42 PM
Yeah, I have noticed some weird stuff going on lately. I saw a Brunt planet get killed then colonized by the Fringe. The planet produced Brunt ships with Fringe flags.I've seen this once or twice and actually I kind of like it. It's a cool idea that different planets retain traces of the culture of previous rulers. As long as the ships are getting the new race's stats and it doesn't happen too often, I think it's fun. Maybe a slight palette change would be needed on the hybrid ships (can't remember if this already happens).

Tuidjy
08-10-2013, 04:29 PM
The bug is still around in the last beta patch (1.018).

The Dryads and the Hive are allied, love each other, and are fighting Utopians. The Hive destroys a planet. The Dryads colonize the planet and declare war on the Hive.

http://i.imgur.com/hTc5eAP.jpg

CaptainWinky
08-13-2013, 01:39 PM
I noticed some odd hostilities in my current game with the 1.018 patch too. The situation: After a lot of positive rumor spreading, I was allied with Lithosoid, Dryad, and Utopian and had them beginning to form non-aggression pacts with each other. Overlord took over a Dryad planet. I flew in and destroyed the Overlord colony which had no defending ships at all. The game announced that Lithosoid had destroyed Overlord, and immediately Dryad declared war on Lithosoid. I got Lith to make peace but Dryad wasn't having it: they kept declaring war until I gave up trying to smooth things over. I did notice a Dryad ship flying around that was shooting missiles at me for some reason.

A few minutes later the Zarlok took over a Dryad planet. I reached the Zarlok planet and noticed two Zarlok ships patrolling, a Zarlok Destroyer and a Titan. I quickly destroyed the colony, and the Titan turned to Dryad and started attacking me.

Buzzard
08-17-2013, 02:05 PM
I'm seeing what seems to be a relations/diplomacy bug in my current game. At the start of the current situation we have Talon, Dryad, Lithosoid, and Scavengers as remaining races. The latter three have very good relations with each other and are allied in a war against Talon (who have only one planet left).

Then things unraveled almost instantaneously: All three races are now at war with each other, even though their relations are still very good (green on the screen and 70+, even after shooting at each other for a moderate amount of time). When I go to the diplomacy screens for each of the former allies, the only "Make Peace" option shown is Talon. The other races show up under the "Make War" screen -- as if all were still at peace with each other (and are just shooting at each other and destroying colonies because they are bored).

So, I'm not sure what caused the allies to go to war with each other (random event?, Bug?) and don't understand why their warring status isn't reflected on the diplomacy screen (where your ever-helpful, self-interested Drox could meddle to rectify the situation).

At present, all of the options for the Drox are in the "bad" range, as I try to salvage a win strategy. Ironically, the Drox manages to remain allied with all of the warring parties, though the ratings are gradually slipping as I sell off drops. The Lithosoids are the most powerful race in this mess, and Drox HQ wants them to survive, so they will become the default Drox ally of choice.

Still, even though it is possible to play the situation as part of the game, the randomness of everyone in the universe suddenly deciding to go to war with their friends is a bit annoying. If this were the result of some sort of massive "Karma" event that could be fixed by a quest, that might be interesting.

Buzzard
08-17-2013, 03:28 PM
OK. I think I discovered what happened with the diplomacy screens - and that was due to my mistake.

However, the original condition was a game event.

Tuidjy
08-19-2013, 04:42 PM
The hostilities out of nowhere bug is present in 1.019.

I think I have encountered it in every single one of the ten last sectors I have played. My allies ALWAYS go to war at some point, and because their planets are at that time totally mixed up, anywhere from a few to a dozen planets go poof before I can broker a lasting peace.

In my present game, the Drakk are down to two planets, from 14, because their former allies the Fringe keep declaring war on them

Tuidjy
08-20-2013, 04:11 PM
I have experienced the HOON bug so many times now, that I think I know when it is coming, and maybe how to avoid it.

(1) When Legion/Talon/Overlord takes over a planet belonging to your alliance, SAVE & QUIT, then RELOAD. Someone from your alliance may still destroy it, but the original owner will not declare war on the ally that destroyed it.

(2) When a member of your alliance destroys an enemy planet that can still be colonized SAVE & QUIT, then RELOAD. Someone from your alliance may still colonize it, but will not declare war on whoever destroyed it in the first place.

By doing this, I have gone about an hour without having my alliance fall apart. Seems like an achievement, these days.

Tuidjy
08-23-2013, 08:43 PM
The HooN bug is still in 1.020

I stopped doing my Save/Quit/Load dance in the last sector, and lo and behold, my allies are at each other's throats. I cannot express how tired I am of this bug. With the new persistent galaxy I'm trying to lead the useful races to prosperous coexistence and mutual support, which is damn hard when they ALWAYS turn on each other because of the damn bug.

http://i.imgur.com/oZaiwtx.jpg

Axegrinder
08-24-2013, 08:30 PM
I can feel the pain. Hopefully it's on the back burner in the next patch

Tuidjy
08-25-2013, 05:53 PM
This used to be a full four way alliance. I wasn't a member, because I wanted to milk the sector for all it was worth. Talon took over a Fringe planet, the alliance crushed them in the blink of an eye... and the reverted ships started attacking everyone. The alliance fell apart. I managed to bring things to order.. but only after I declared war on the Fringe (whose flag the 'confused' ships were flying) and destroying everyone who would not obey the peace treaty.

http://i.imgur.com/4dPwpTL.jpg

Shadow
08-26-2013, 10:11 AM
This is one of those that I can't seem to reproduce, so it's being illusive.

LordGek
08-26-2013, 11:25 AM
Is this whole thing based on the colonizing mishaps mentioned previously?

Alien A and B are at war.
Alien A wipes out a B colony.
Alien C now settles the just cleared B colony.
Alien A, who has no guff with C, still considers the colony an enemy settlement from when B owned it thus suddenly A and C are at war.

CaptainWinky
08-26-2013, 11:49 AM
I had this happen to me in a recent sector (1.020). I had Lithosoid and their Asexual subrace in an alliance. One of the monster races took over a Lith planet and when the monster race was defeated, the remaining ships changed back to Lith. Shortly thereafter Lith and Asexual were at war. I immediately saved and quit like Tuidjy suggested, then after resuming I was able to get the two races to stop fighting and start rebuilding relations. Next time there's a monster race takeover I will save/reload BEFORE the monster race is destroyed and see if the previous owner goes to war with anybody or not.

I'm just guessing here but I think it has something to do with how the ownership of ships is handled. I noticed another weird thing in that same game. I was responsible for helping the Asexuals gain independence (yeah I got them to ally with their parent race just as a challenge) so I got to see two planets change hands. It looked like Asexuals had several ships flying around their planets (inherited from Lith?), but in the races screen it showed that Asexual had zero ships. Weird....

Tuidjy
08-26-2013, 12:02 PM
The problem with reproducing the bug is that saving and restoring fixes things. Even if I make a copy 30 seconds before I expect the bug to occur, and occur it does, the reloaded copy will not exhibit any problems.

Tyrax Lightning
08-26-2013, 01:33 PM
I found the Dryad in a recent Challenge Sector & was at normal but not non-aggression pact relationship with them, & a Gate had spawned 2 feet from the first Dryad Planet I found & I blew it up with the Dryad Ship Guard's help... after that, the Dryad Ship was shooting at ME while still not being flagged as an enemy. I ducked into a nearby Dimensional Pocket for a moment, came back out, did some other things, then came back to that same planet & ship, & that ship did not repeat its attack on me.

I have no clue what I coulda done to Bleep off that Ship... especially a DRYAD one... :confused:

Weapons I was using at the time:

EM Shockwave
Interceptor Bay (all 3 Interceptors were out & fighting at the time.)I couldn't turn in the Quest for that blown up Gate at first, till I met the Lithosoid, then turned out to be a Lithosoid Quest. The Dryad & Lithosoid had no known aggression between them at that time...

Shadow
08-26-2013, 05:17 PM
I found another way to reproduce this and this particular bug is fixed in 1.021.

ScrObot
08-30-2013, 07:10 AM
I've had this happen again in a new sector with 1.021, though it wasn't the "ship immediately changes races" problem.

Drox, Brunt, Utopian and Mutant, all in an Alliance or Mutual Protection Pact with each other, were all at war against Drakk and Dryad (in a Non Aggression Pact) and Legion. We destroyed a Drakk planet. About five minutes later, Mutant colonized that planet, and immediately declared war on Brunt, whom they were in an Alliance with (still with good relations). Utopian, in a Mutual Protection Pact with Brunt, honored their Mutant Alliance and also declared war on Brunt. Utopian and Mutant both still had high relations with Brunt, but Brunt now had high 30s with both of them rather than 75+ before the shenanigans.

It's messy in the relations screen too. In the trade interface, Brunt isn't an option under "Make peace with" for either Utopian or Mutant, even though it shows a red dotted line and "(War)" in their respective relations lines.

I tried a few things including declaring war on Brunt myself then having Mutant and Utopian make peace with Brunt, but the relations screen still showed them at war. I also tried exiting and reloading not long after it happened, which didn't do anything helpful. I have a save if it's helpful.

ScrObot
08-30-2013, 07:16 AM
...And shortly afterwards, Utopian colonized a planet in the same system that I'm pretty sure was previously destroyed by us, and their ally Mutant immediately declared war on them. So much for my four way diplomatic win plan. :)

Shadow
08-30-2013, 11:00 AM
That sad thing is each time I fix definite bugs. There's just more than 1 way for all of this to happen. :(

LordGek
08-30-2013, 12:09 PM
That sad thing is each time I fix definite bugs. There's just more than 1 way for all of this to happen. :(

There definitely seems to be a theme with "re-colonization confusion".

Tuidjy
09-02-2013, 07:01 PM
There definitely seems to be a theme with "re-colonization confusion".

The only times I have seen this bug in 1.021 has been after re-colonization. There is definite progress - I have no doubt that eventually it will get completely squashed.

Tuidjy
10-27-2013, 01:47 AM
I hoped that I would not have to resurrect this thread, but the HOON bug is definitely present in 1.030. I was artificially extending my stay in a level 160 sector by not allying with the all of the remaining (mostly allied) races, and I had three wars start immediately after a planet was colonized, despite the races in question being quite friendly, as evidenced by my brokering peace immediately afterwards. This is the log from the third time it happened:

01:04:21 - Scavenger has colonized Dorsplar in the Taurux system.
01:04:22 - Scavenger declares War on Drakk
01:04:22 - Fringe honors Alliance with Scavenger, declares War on Drakk
01:04:24 - Fringe and Drakk declare peace
01:04:24 - Scavenger and Drakk declare peace

By the way, even after I broker peace, the races are not guaranteed to cease hostilities unless I quit and reload.

Tuidjy
11-15-2013, 04:56 PM
I have practically stopped using diplomacy for brokering alliances. And this is why:


00:07:07 - The colony on Ritta (Utopian) in Lupus has been destroyed by Blood Claw.
[snip]
00:10:22 - Dryad and Fringe have forged an Alliance
[snip]
00:10:55 - Dryad has colonized Ritta in the Lupus system.
[snip]
00:11:44 - Dryad declares War on Fringe

Shadow, please look at this issue again. I know you have fixed many, many ways in which this used to occur, but there is at least one left in 1.032.

Shadow
11-15-2013, 07:02 PM
I'll look at it again.

Tuidjy
12-17-2013, 01:32 AM
Unfortunately, this log is from v1.034. The Fringe and the Utopians had a non-aggression pact, and were kicking Zarlok all over the sector.

00:10:29 - The colony on Vlangini (Zarlok) in Izarctria has been destroyed by Fringe.
[snip]
00:10:57 - Utopian has colonized Vlangini in the Izarctria system.
[snip]
00:11:25 - Utopian declares War on Fringe
00:11:27 - Utopian and Fringe declare peace

No save will help with pinpointing the problem, because quitting and loading prevents it from occurring. Still, it happens with terrible regularity when you have multiple races beating on another.