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View Full Version : Mod questions: Crew, CrewSpecialized, SpawnChance


ZenLOSER
12-29-2013, 09:21 PM
Edit: Grayed out things I think I understand now, see second post.

So I was looking to up the chance for crew to drop. I dug around in the Crew and CrewSpecialized files and I had a few questions that I hope someone can clear up :).

So I see in Crew that the base crew SpawnChance is set to 0.3. The spawn chance in base item is 1. Am I correct in assuming that this is a weighted sum sorta thing?

Like say there were only 3 types of item, lasers, armor, crew and they had spawn chance 1, 1, and 0.3 then it rolls a random number from 0 to 2.3 (the sum) and those are the relative weights?

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Crew41, the robot crew type, says 0.6. I assume this is an override to the 0.3 and thus they are more likely to spawn? Or is this a subset chance? Like as above it would need to roll the 0.3 chance for crew then another roll for subtype of crew and thus robots are LESS likely to spawn than others?

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Similar question for CrewSpecialized. It shows 0.1 spawn chance. Is this just another type along with crew so adding it in our example, 1, 1, 0.3, 0.1 so sum 2.4 and roll with specialized crew being another part of the first roll? Or is it a subtype sorta deal, it has to roll the 0.3 and then roll again to check for specialized so the 0.1 is a small fraction of things already rolled as crew?

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Last question...where are crew that have multiple bonuses to skills? Specialized crew seem to have higher modifiers and level skills faster but I wasn't able to see where multi-skill crew was created. It looked like it was still just about single skill crew. I don't think I fully understand the Magic sections, however, so it may just be a normal thing that can roll on crew...dunno.

ZenLOSER
01-01-2014, 03:11 PM
So I have messed with things rather a lot and found some interesting stuff. CrewSpecialized does seem to be a separate roll from Crew. Actually each Crew/CrewSpecialized seems a separate item on the loot table as well but only can drop if that race is in the current sector.

Changing the SpawnChance on crew seems to have really negative consequences...I'd almost consider filing this as a bug really. If you up the SpawnChance to a ludicrous level you will find something strange happens...nothing drops for most sources in the game.

Apparently the system rolls for treasure and if it comes up crew and the item has NoCrew 1 or that race isn't in the sector then it just doesn't drop any item at all. So this means if you want to increase the drop rate even a small amount you are simultaneously REDUCING the drop rate of items from sources that can't spawn crew and in general reducing drop chance of non-crew loot due to races not in the sector.

Even a small change has a huge effect because there are ~90 entries of Crew and CrewSpecialized. If you move all their spawn chances to 1 you just created a huge pool of failed rolls for that race not being in the game or that chest not being allowed to drop crew.

You can change BaseChest to NoCrew 0 but it means you get crew in weird places sometimes...that can solve one side of things but it doesn't solve the other side of fails based on race.

This is quite disappointing. It would be far better if it rerolled when it hit a fail until it didn't fail.

Tuidjy
01-01-2014, 11:34 PM
I cannot help you with most of the questions, but there's one for which I have an answer.

Last question...where are crew that have multiple bonuses to skills? Specialized crew seem to have higher modifiers and level skills faster but I wasn't able to see where multi-skill crew was created. It looked like it was still just about single skill crew. I don't think I fully understand the Magic sections, however, so it may just be a normal thing that can roll on crew...dunno.

These are just standard crew which have rolled a high 'tweaked' rating. For every one of these, the crew member seems to get an extra skill or bonus. Skills are Helm/Tactics/etc, and bonuses are critical/power/etc...

It seems that specialists are never tweaked.

ZenLOSER
01-02-2014, 12:18 AM
Ok that's what I thought about the Crew then. I do still wonder a little if the sum total amount of skill a level 100 specialist has vs a level 100 guy with 3 skills will be higher or lower. The non-specialist gets less per level but if he started high maybe he will start with more than his normal share...I'm not high enough to know that one yet :).

It is sad about how the drop chances work though. I would really like to be able to up the drop chance slightly but it will cause drops that would have been gear from storage lockers etc to suddenly become nothing at all when they roll crew and hit the NoCrew flag.

I wish failed gear rerolled a few times to attempt to not fail. Maybe it does. No real way to know that without Shadow :).

Tuidjy
01-02-2014, 05:05 AM
I do still wonder a little if the sum total amount of skill a level 100 specialist has vs a level 100 guy with 3 skills will be higher or lower. The non-specialist gets less per level but if he started high maybe he will start with more than his normal share...I'm not high enough to know that one yet

A generalist can definitely get a higher total than a specialist. I do not think that specialists can have more than 51 in their skill, while I've had generalists with totals well over 80. Totals over 100 should be theoretically possible.

In my experience, specialists are more useful for mounting passive components for which you do not have the skills, i.e. they spend most of their time in your cargo hold, while generalists are more useful for staying on watch, i.e. they are usually staying in a light slot, supplying their bonuses to your ship.

ZenLOSER
01-02-2014, 07:14 AM
For that to be the case does it really need to be a generalist that you obtained at high level? Or is a level 5 guy that you sit with all game going to top out higher?

I am assuming the former. They get such tiny level ups and they are spread between stats. I assume really good generalists have to be found preleveled and you just get them their last few points.

If so I am going to have to spend more time with the drakk haha...

Tuidjy
01-02-2014, 02:00 PM
This is a good question, and not being a developer, take my answer with a grain of salt.

In my experience, as far as the "potential for greatness" is concerned, it does not matter when you recruit the crew member. It seems to me that a crew member is either good or bad at a particular skill, and that determines his level up increases and his final scores at level 100. Thus, if you recruit a great guy at level 5, and fully level him to level 100, he would be just as good as if you recruited him at level 100, fully leveled-up.

I am basing this on my experience leveling 4 ships to level 100. The crew members that had high skills at low levels ended up with skills in the same range as the best crew members I obtained from Drakk quests at level 100. Furthermore, one of my ships leveled two pilots from 5 to 100, and another is leveling 3 gunners from 5 to ~70 so far. In every case, as long as you fully level the crew member, those who were better at level 5 stay better at every level.

The problem lies with fully leveling people. By the way, this means that a crew member levels each skill every five levels. So for example a level 5 generalist with Tactics, Structural, and Engineering would need to level 3 times for levels 5 to 10. The first time his required level will go from 5 to 10, and the next two times, his required level will stay 10.

Leveling crew is easy at low levels, and very, very hard at high levels, because quest experience does not help crew level. At high levels, most of the experience comes from quests, and kill experience diminishes compared to the experience needed for leveling, so it is extremely hard to level, for example, an elite crew member with five skills. You'd have to keep him slotted all the time, and even then, it may not be possible to fully level him for a long, long time.

So, I tend to handle recruitment differently depending on the type of crew members.

1. Specialists and single skill crew members. Invaluable for mounting passive components, by far the most precious for my style of playing. Those have to be recruited at low levels, because they simply do not drop at high levels, and leveled first. Fortunately, you only have to level them only once every five levers.

2. Marines. Great for siphoning cash from races, and really useful for quickly completing some collection quests. Marines live and die by their hit points, and I seldom bother with more than one, so I simply do Drakk race quests again and again, and always keep the healthiest one.

3. Combat crew and generalists. Some of these are great because of the bonuses they deliver, and worth keeping slotted all the time. For example, I have a Drakk with Tactics 25, Helm 26, Computers 22, and critical chance +141%. I have had him slotted since level 20 or so, and do not think he's even fully leveled, despite his ship having been to sector level 200 before the difficulty was raised. Because they are so hard to level, and because they actually keep your ship alive in combat, you are better off just keeping whoever does the most for the ship constantly on watch, and replacing them if you get someone better.

ZenLOSER
01-02-2014, 02:11 PM
Based on what you said it seems like it's not worth leveling a generalist unless you happen to get a really sick one (like your 141 crit guy) since as you say you can just do a few drakk quests to get a proper level one if you are looking for skills.

Tuidjy
01-02-2014, 02:56 PM
In the long run, yes. The thing is, you always have at least one crew member slotted, so you end up always leveling somebody. And because you replace him with a better one as you progress, at some point, the one you're leveling is so good that you no longer find anyone better to replace him with. Not that you should stop looking, i.e. questing for the Drakk.