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View Full Version : petition for devs to allow modders external control of game code


laq
03-11-2014, 11:54 PM
Just like the title says a simple poll/petition trying to poke the developers to allow the modding community the ability to modify / extend the game code

Voiddweller
03-12-2014, 09:02 AM
Can't imagine ppl voting against this...

laq
03-12-2014, 12:31 PM
Can't imagine ppl voting against this...

i imagine this is as close as they can come to feeling like a cool troll

little do they realize how much devs these days especially little guys will and need to listen to the customer base

so anyone thinking that there attempt at sarcasm is still somehow socially relevant is likely also to dumb to realize why one does not cut one's nose to spite one's face

thanks to anyone wanting to actually open up the breadth of opportunity for a strong modding community / the people that contribute to that same community

Castruccio
03-12-2014, 12:59 PM
I'm not sure what you want here. The game is already quite moddable, and Soldak can't release the source code because their livelihood depends on having full control of their game engine and IP.

laq
03-12-2014, 01:20 PM
I'm not sure what you want here. The game is already quite moddable, and Soldak can't release the source code because their livelihood depends on having full control of their game engine and IP.

scripting api = mod/add code without giving up state secrets :p

joku
03-12-2014, 02:45 PM
While I would certainly like a little more power when it comes to modding, it's hard for me to say he should incorporate a scripting system. I have no idea how much work that would entail. I have a feeling that something like this would be difficult if the game wasn't made with a scripting api in mind.

So I guess it's something to consider for future games, but probably not worth the effort to incorporate into the existing games.

Voiddweller
03-13-2014, 12:31 AM
So I guess it's something to consider for future games, but probably not worth the effort to incorporate into the existing games.
ORLY? Like Drox Op is a ten years old game with all copyrights sold to some huge publisher corp? It is a new game, and making another one obviously requires much more effort.

joku
03-13-2014, 05:38 AM
ORLY? Like Drox Op is a ten years old game with all copyrights sold to some huge publisher corp?

Uh, no? That doesn't really have anything to do with what I said. How old a game is has no bearing whatsoever on whether or not the game was programmed in such a way that incorporating a scripting api would be feasible.

My point was that I could see it being the case that incorporating something like this might be impossible in the game's current state due to the way the game was programmed. Doing this might require extensive rewriting of code, which would likely lead to breaking things and a plethora of new bugs that would affect everyone, including those who never had any intention of ever using a mod. This could mean months of work to both add the api and then quash all the resultant bugs. That's months that could have been spent working on a second expansion, or a new game entirely.

If he waits and adds the api to his next game, then when he's programming his next game, he can do so while keeping the api in mind. This would greatly reduce the work involved in incorporating the api.


And as I said from the beginning: I don't know how much work would be involved in incorporating something like this. If it's something relatively easy to do that won't cause a lot of bugs, then of course I would like him to do it. But if it's going to involve months of work, then I'd rather he put his time to better use.

Bluddy
03-13-2014, 03:12 PM
This is a huge undertaking and has 0 chance of happening IMO. It involves taking a language like Lua or Python, making it work with the game engine, then deciding how much of the game code to port to the scripting language, then porting that code over, solving countless bugs etc. It's not happening for Drox, and it probably isn't happening for the next game either, since that will build off of Drox's infrastructure.

It's much more common to see this kind of design in bigger companies where you have artists who don't really know how to code, expert engine programmers, and many designers/scripters who need to iterate without bothering the programmers or rebuilding the whole engine. The benefits to Soldak from adopting this architecture are minimal -- in fact, it'll just slow down the game by a certain factor.

What would interest me would be some kind of license whereby the game code can be given to modders, either by signing an NDA, or by some restrictive semi-open source license where all modifications still belong to Soldak. Modders/programmers could then help port the game to other platforms, weed out bugs, improve performance, etc all for the chance to help the community.

Voiddweller
03-15-2014, 02:46 PM
Yeah yeah... "leave it as it is, i like it that way" pffff...
It's a shame that Drox OP is not very popular, cos there are hacks for popular games to externalize key functions. Good solution when there is no way to change code.

joku
03-15-2014, 07:28 PM
Yeah yeah... "leave it as it is, i like it that way" pffff...

Nobody is saying that we like having less modding power. What we're saying is, while it would be nice to have more power, the amount of work necessary to make it happen simply isn't justifiable.

Cryosis
03-16-2014, 04:20 PM
Nobody is saying that we like having less modding power. What we're saying is, while it would be nice to have more power, the amount of work necessary to make it happen simply isn't justifiable.


To add some perspective, most games that have a scripting extensibility were designed with it the beginning, either as a method to prototype and implement changes without rebuilding code to enhance workflow or strictly to provide modding functionality. Obviously I don't know what Drox's code base looks like, but adding scripting after the fact would be like asking a car manufacturer to swap out your gas engine to an electric. Even though the results of having the electric engine are similar, you would need to change the transmission, find places to put in batteries, rework the suspension, ect ect ect. (sorry if that's a terrible analogy)

While I would love to have more flexibility with modding Drox, I don't think it's fair to criticize them for not having the functionality and not adding it in based on consumer request.