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graffen69
08-05-2012, 12:06 AM
I´ve found 3 Cargo Bays in the game altogether and I found them all before lvl 11. At lvl 31 it seems I spend most of my time flying back and forth to planets cuz my bags are full all the time. I can´t stock up anything in the shared bank cuz I got no spare bays.
I´m playing Cortex (only 1 “build”) and using latest version (1.13) if that makes any difference.
Maybe i´m just extremely unlucky, but i played since beta and noticed no difference. Anyone else having these issues?


Regarding failed Quests - is there a reason failed quests aren't auto cleared?
Suggestion: Auto clear failed Quests so you can pickup new ones without needing to bring up the Quest log (/delete failed quest).

Vassago
08-05-2012, 04:15 PM
Level 66 at the moment, only found enough cargo bays to fill the ship.
Can's use either stashes because I don't have cargo bays, it's a bitch.

graffen69
08-06-2012, 03:17 PM
Ok, then it´s definitely not just me. Seems odd, since the bag drop from former Soldak games (DoP/DC) wasn´t a hazzle. Or maybe it was in the early game?

Bluddy
08-06-2012, 03:47 PM
Ok, then it´s definitely not just me. Seems odd, since the bag drop from former Soldak games (DoP/DC) wasn´t a hazzle. Or maybe it was in the early game?

Inventory bags have been a huge complaint in Din's Curse, even though their drop rates weren't that low. In DoP they weren't an issue because you could trade from anywhere.

graffen69
08-28-2012, 07:40 AM
Uhmm, is this gonna be addressed soon?
Still have Drox O. on hold until there's enough cargo to actually play the game.

Shadow
08-28-2012, 01:28 PM
Larger cargo bays got a drop chance boost in 0.917 and their icons where made more obvious also in one of the more recent patches.

PixelLord
08-28-2012, 01:57 PM
I've found only 1 medium bay in the past 2 days of playing, and still haven't seen a single large bay yet (level 18 ship); so you may still want to tweak the drop rates up a bit for the larger bays.

DarkTraveler
08-28-2012, 02:29 PM
Why not make cargo bays one of the level up rewards if the player's inventory space doesn't meet a specific value?

Moonshine Fox
08-29-2012, 12:27 PM
Why not make cargo bays one of the level up rewards if the player's inventory space doesn't meet a specific value?

From a game-design and gameplay perspective, does cargo bays actually add anything of value? All it does is prevent you to pick up all the loot that drops, easily circumvented by going multiple trips. This is made even easier if there are planets nearby.

All in all, it's just an artifical limit of what you can carry at any one time, for no reason at all. I've really never understood inventory systems that "grow" over time, unless it impacts actual gameplay: See Deus Ex: Human Revolution, for an example where inventory size affects gameplay (your choice of carried weapon and gear).

In Din's and Drox, it really brings nothing to the table. Or am I missing anything vital here?

EDIT: What I'm trying to say is, why limit inventory space for beginning characters at all? Why not simply let everyone have an inventory that houses a set number of slots comparable to a high level character. Say, someone with 4 very large or what they are called. 12x5 total.

DarkTraveler
08-29-2012, 01:09 PM
From a game-design and gameplay perspective, does cargo bays actually add anything of value? All it does is prevent you to pick up all the loot that drops, easily circumvented by going multiple trips. This is made even easier if there are planets nearby.

All in all, it's just an artifical limit of what you can carry at any one time, for no reason at all. I've really never understood inventory systems that "grow" over time, unless it impacts actual gameplay: See Deus Ex: Human Revolution, for an example where inventory size affects gameplay (your choice of carried weapon and gear).

In Din's and Drox, it really brings nothing to the table. Or am I missing anything vital here?

Unless one enjoys making many trips back to town or planet then it's perfectly viable to seek more inventory space.

I played Deus Ex. One of my all time favorite games. Your comparison has no relevance. Deus Ex's style is completely different from that of a Soldek Entertainment game. To name just a few items, Deus Ex had neither the amount of drops, nor the many groups of enemies that Soldek Entertainment games do.

Moonshine Fox
08-29-2012, 01:10 PM
Unless one enjoys making many trips back to town or planet then it's perfectly viable to seek more inventory space. The answer is obvious enough, so I suspect you are trolling for some reason.

I played Deus Ex. One of my all time favorite games. Your comparison has no relevance. Deus Ex's style is completely different from that of a Soldek Entertainment game. To name just a few items, Deus Ex had neither the amount of drops, nor the many groups of enemies that Soldek Entertainment games do.

I'm most certainly not trolling, and I can't see how you would think I do. My question touches the very notion of expandable inventory space. Why have it at all, when you can just give everyone the max to begin with? What is the design goal with having a severely limited inventory space?

DarkTraveler
08-29-2012, 01:19 PM
EDIT: What I'm trying to say is, why limit inventory space for beginning characters at all? Why not simply let everyone have an inventory that houses a set number of slots comparable to a high level character. Say, someone with 4 very large or what they are called. 12x5 total.

You had to go and explain what you really meant after I posted. Dang you. :p

I see what you're saying now. I have to say that finding cargo bays in Drox or bags in Din's Curse is fun. I enjoy it. If I simply started out with max inventory space it wouldn't be as fun. Not for me, anyway.

In Din's Curse, actually getting more inventory space WAS fun and wasn't a chore. If you didn't find any bags, then chances are a vendor had some for sale anyway. Yet, it seemed the Vendor stopped selling bags once you reached a certain point. That way, if you found a bag later on, it was still useful and thus felt like a good thing. The formula was good here.

It's not so in Drox. If the random numbers aren't with you and you don't find any cargo bays then you're screwed. At least that's how it is at he moment. Not sure why Mr. Peeler would want to change the winning formula.

DarkTraveler
08-29-2012, 01:24 PM
I'm most certainly not trolling, and I can't see how you would think I do. My question touches the very notion of expandable inventory space. Why have it at all, when you can just give everyone the max to begin with? What is the design goal with having a severely limited inventory space?

Well, you didn't explain yourself clearly at first and it was misunderstood. But, you explained in the edit. It's all good as far as I'm concerned.

Moonshine Fox
08-29-2012, 01:27 PM
You had to go and explain what you really meant after I posted. Dang you. :p
Sorry :P
I see what you're saying now. I have to say that finding cargo bays in Drox or bags in Din's Curse is fun. I enjoy it. If I simply started out with max inventory space it wouldn't be as fun. Not for me, anyway.


Well, that part of the joy is somewhat more a part of the random loot system. You get excited about a lot of drops. Inventory shouldn't (necessarily) really be a part of it. Several games have near unlimited inventory space, in spite of not having such a large amount of drops. (Se A Valley Without Wind, for instance. Over 110 inventory slots, yet not that much random drops).

My point is, what game design is behind the limited inventory, and what function is it supposed to fill? If it's a sense of progression, then frankly the random drops do a better job of that together with levelling up. It also does it without the frustation of being limited (in the same way) initially.

If it's to prevent hoarding, it really doesn't, because the person who is really anal about picking up everything and selling it will simply go several trips. Heck, people even did this in Deus Ex:HR where you could only carry one weapon. They sell their weapon, run back and get the spare, sell that, run back, sell that etc. Completionists will alway be completionists, minmaxers will always be minmaxers. This mechanic does not stop them, just mildly inconvenience them.

I understand the idea, because limited bagspace has been a staple of the aRPG genre for like...forever. My huge gripe is the excessively small space you start with. It would, in my eyes, be better to start with somethingaround 50 slots and that's it. That's your inventory. It doesn't grow, it doesn't shrink. It's just that.

Or, if you absolutely have to have it grow, make it a part of levelling up command. Bigger ship = more cargo space. That way it's controllable, and not so random.

DarkTraveler
08-29-2012, 02:40 PM
My point is, what game design is behind the limited inventory, and what function is it supposed to fill?



It's not to prevent hoarding. The fact that we have our stash, shared stash and so much loot tells me otherwise.

I think that Game makers feel there needs to be some kind of downtime in a game, especially in RPGs. Otherwise customers complain it's boring due to the lack of variety in the experience. The old trip back to town to sell your loot is the most often used method. Same reason why resting is mandatory in some RPGs. For game makers, this is a primary concern. For the actual gamer, this is more subconscious than conscious.

Also, it used to be that going to the shop to sell your loot was a nice experience. The problem with diablo-style games is that there's so much loot that this experience is lost.


Heck, people even did this in Deus Ex:HR where you could only carry one weapon. They sell their weapon, run back and get the spare, sell that, run back, sell that etc.


Not for me. When I played Deux Ex I ran around with many different weapons. In fact, for the majority of that game I usually had only one itty bitty square of inventory space open. :p

I usually never picked up weapons I didn't want. Didn't need to sell them to make money. I used computer skills to hack people's bank accounts in that game. It's been a while since I played Deux Ex, but I don't remember money being terribly important in that game anyway.


My huge gripe is the excessively small space you start with. It would, in my eyes, be better to start with somethingaround 50 slots and that's it. That's your inventory. It doesn't grow, it doesn't shrink. It's just that.


The first Soldek game I played was Din's Curse. When I first saw that tiny backpack space I was like... eh? Then after I found a bag, then bought another bag I was like... ah.

That was less than 5 minutes in when I first tried the demo. Notice how I've now bought Drox and am posting in the forums, etc.

In Dox, we get some reward when we level up. I hate to say it, but most of the time the level up reward is just vendor trash. Cargo bays could change that. Plus, it would solve the problem of not finding them as random drops.

Like, let's say you just leveled up. The game mechanic goes something like this..

If player level >=5
If inventory space = 16 (no cargo bays found)
Then give a cargo bay for a level up reward

And then do something similar at levels 10, 15, etc.

Now, sure.. someone could exploit that. Like, a veteran player could drop his cargo bays just before leveling up to 5, then pick them back up again.

Considering the big picture, though, just how bad of an exploit would it really be? Having at least _some_ exploitable things in a game should be as mandatory as other game elements. It adds to the fun because it makes a player feel smart. I wonder how many of Mr. Peeler's fanboys are people who exploited DoP bugs back in the day? Bet there's at least a few. :p

Or he could just do it like he did in Din's Curse. Make some vendor that sells cargo bays depending on how much you already have.

Moonshine Fox
08-29-2012, 02:50 PM
It's not to prevent hoarding. The fact that we have our stash, shared stash and so much loot tells me otherwise.

I think that Game makers feel there needs to be some kind of downtime in a game, especially in RPGs. Otherwise customers complain it's boring due to the lack of variety in the experience. The old trip back to town to sell your loot is the most often used method.

You'd still have that, only less often. Besides, it'd be the same as if you were maxed out on inventory as a high level character in this game. So that's not really a convincing argument, even though I see your point.

Not for me. When I played Deux Ex I ran around with many different weapons. In fact, for the majority of that game I usually had only one itty bitty square of inventory space open. :p That was only an example of how people go out of their way to max their currency/XP, so adding mechanics to curb such behaviour is foolish at best, since they'll just find ways around it. Most players are casuals and don't bother, so inconveniencing the casual majority to stop minmaxers (and failing) isn't a good idea either. That was what I was trying to convey with that analogy. :)

In Dox, we get some reward when we level up. I hate to say it, but most of the time the level up reward is just vendor trash.Maybe, maybe not. I've found that as Shadow, getting better cloaks was very consistent up until I "cheated" and entered a game 15 levels above mine and fought hard to beat it. The loot from there is still with me. Otherwise I would've gotten a better cloak almost every level, when I wasn't getting crew or a standoff armor. For my Drakk however, I find it's mostly vendor trash.

Cargo bays could change that. Plus, it would solve the problem of not finding them as random drops.That would simply lead to a linear progression of inventory, similar to the Command-level up I suggested earlier, in addition to taking away your level up reward component. Just to give you more inventory space.

Make some vendor that sells cargo bays depending on how much you already have.

This already happens. I had the Fringe sell me Medium Cargo bays (8 slot) as an essential item (meaning there was limitless stock). I bought enough for all my three ships and their stashes.

Moonshine Fox
08-29-2012, 04:10 PM
I'm also thinking about what Shadow himself said in one of the blogs:

Right now I'm thinking there will be no weight requirements. I have seen this done in a lot of space games, but I would like you to be able to find a decent amount of loot. Having weight limits really gets in the way of loot and loot is fun.
The same could be said for limited inventory space, really.

graffen69
08-30-2012, 11:06 AM
Does poverty and/or unlucky affect cargo bay drops?

Shadow
08-30-2012, 11:36 AM
Does poverty and/or unlucky affect cargo bay drops?

Poverty will decreased the chances of cargo bays a little since it will make less components drop.

Unlucky will actually increase the chances of cargo bays some because it makes less "magic" components drop and thus more normal components.

graffen69
08-31-2012, 07:17 AM
I see, playing with both on main ship. Played 25 levels with patch 0.917 & 0.918, at level 58 now and still haven’t found one single cargo bay since lvl 11. I had to make a couple mules just so I could fill my shared bank with 4 slotters. Still seems extremely hard finding bays beyond the first few levels.

Suggestion: An automatic quest-notifier when a quest is completed in the default screen. Also some notification of where your black box is located (or black boxes if several deaths) would be welcomed (usually don´t pay much attention to which sector I´m playing in) & an auto-clear on failed missions.

Is there a way to check race modifications in the default menu or do I have to go to the “create a new player” screen? If so, some way of checking your race bonuses without having to save/exit would be useful.

I found what I think is a spelling error, second to last line on: HELP TOPIC – DESTRUCTION: …”However, if you go can to retrieve that dropped”… sounds like “go” & “can” are switched.

DarkTraveler
08-31-2012, 08:54 AM
This already happens. I had the Fringe sell me Medium Cargo bays (8 slot) as an essential item (meaning there was limitless stock). I bought enough for all my three ships and their stashes.

When I saw this I started zipping around from planet to planet to see if I'd been missing them. Now that I was actively watching out for cargo bays being sold by planetary vendors I started seeing them. I was able to find and buy 3 in a span of about 4-5 minutes.

I guess it was possible to miss them if you didn't specifically look for them. I understand the latest patch puts a + on them so you notice them more.

graffen69
08-31-2012, 12:02 PM
Nods, always check every single item in every vendor i find. Maybe i´m just unlucky, but playing a few ships now and the only time i can seem to find any bays is in the starting zones of new toons.